I posted a bit over a month ago after bad tubes in my then new PS-100 caused the unit to malfunction. Fryette got the new tubes and fuses out to me right away & that appeared to fix the issue, but then I noticed, intermittently, some issues with the sound. In a nutshell, it sometimes just sounds thin, like the low end is gone.
Last week I purchased another PS-100 so I could have one on either side of my stereo setup in my studio. The other day I ran a little test where I recorded myself playing a riff through an amp into this PS-100, then through the new PS-100, with the exact same settings & the difference is pretty clear.
I purchased both units through Vintage King and have been in contact with their CS, who suggested I also post the issue here since Fryette’s CS is so good about checking these forums (which has also been my experience).
I should also note - when I’ve experienced this issue - it’s been with the Level switch in the OUT (Lo) position as I was trying to match the volume of the amp’s output so I could compare the sound with amp without the PS-100. I saw a video where Steven mentioned that there’s no ‘rule’ where this switch should be set so figured it’s just to determine overall output level.
I can certainly see the levels of the red track are a little lower and it has a bit more bite. I can’t say that anything sounds wrong to me; both actually sound pretty good.
This kind of subtle difference usually comes down to a different setting somewhere with the reactive load toggle switches, presence, depth controls or input and output volume levels. There is also natural variation in parts, so to get exactly the same soun
Yes, this is true, and I would expand that to all the settings and toggles, try your best to match the sound. If the PS-100 power amp is distorting and sagging, then level will be important because it will be adding Power Amp mojo to the tone. That cannot be expected to sound the same as a quiet PS-100.
Here is what I would do:
Make all setting identical
Record A and B.
Listen and adjust until you cannot tell the difference.
Hey Dan, thanks for replying and for your kind words!
Regarding the recorded clips, were you listening through headphones or large-ish speakers? When I listen there’s a pretty big drop off in low end on the Red parts - it feels a lot more thin. I also repeated the experiment yesterday with the level switches set to Hi & the result is the same. All the settings on each PS are identical.
It would be interesting to hear the difference with both clips A and B having the same input level if there is any difference.
Can you tweak the various settings to see if you can match the sounds?
Just to check, the gain in your DAW does not change? And it’s the same cables. You literally just disconnected on PS-100 and replaced it with the other?
Hi Dan - yea I literally swapped the cables from PS #1 to PS #2. Same amp, speakers, input channels. Nothing different.
I’m not able to dial in the one unit to sound full like the other one.
Again, I had the issue with the bad tubes and blown fuse when I first got the unit a couple months ago. It sounds to me like those tubes took something else out not not being a tech, I can’t say what it is.
Yes I can definitely do that but it’ll have to be in a couple hours - I gotta run to my cardiac rehab session (recovering from a heart attack, bypass & all that). I’ll get on that when I get back.
Sorry to hear that. Just sub-ed to your channel I will be back tomorrow (I’m in UK), but I think @Gil is around; he might intercept your messages before me. Or if I have some helpful suggestions tonight, I will chime in. The problem is that by the time I’m normally free, it’s 11pm and my brain is mush.
I ran another little test with the PS-100s’ level switches set to lo & the difference is even more stark now. With regard to the difference in levels, I simply moved the connections from one PS100 to the other, both tracks in the DAW were set identically but there’s a roughly 6db difference.
I’ll also include photos of the front and rear panels as well. I see now that the speaker impedance is blocked by the cable on the bottom unit - both switches on each unit are set to 8 ohms. I’m using the bottom channel on both PS-100s.
Well, what did I say…? It’s almost 11pm and I am back on the forum…
This is interesting… I now hear a much larger drop in volume but I don’t hear the thin bass.
It’s very tricky to match the volume exactly with the volume knobs because they are quite sensitive. But see if you can increase the quiet one by turning the volume knob up. I would not trust the human eye to be able to actually match the angle between two PS-100 volume knobs anyway. But the ear can probably hear fractions of a degree. This type of comparison almost certainly needs to be done by ear to match the levels. Also even if you could match the angle exactly, it would still not be the same due to component-to-component variation.
Let’s take it from there. If there are still tonal differences, I need to get some advice from the shop tomorrow.
PS. Try backing off the line level; set them both to 12 O’clock.
Also, I am assuming the line out is connected to the audio interface or preamp with high input impedance, something in the range of 10k or better? I have made this mistake once on my https://focusrite.com/products/scarlett-solo: in MIC input mode the impedance is only 3k and in LINE mode it is 60k. The lower input impedance can roll off lower frequencies.
Hi Dan - the line level is separate and apart from what’s being heard in the clips. I have those run, through a snake, into my interface in case I want to record the raw amp signal to use with IR’s in a late night situation or something, but they’re not in the signal path of what’s being heard. The sound being heard in the recordings is coming in through microphones on the speaker cabinet (Mesa 4x12 with Vintage 30’s).
Ok, I upped the volume on the faulty PS-100 to where it sounds about the same level, maybe a touch louder in the recording - the volume on the faulty unit is at noon, the new PS-100 is around 10:00. I turned the depth knob all the way up and the bottom switch to Deep. Not the same kind of depth.
Again, same amp, speakers and mics, same inputs on the interface and channels in the DAW set identical. All I did was move the Amp in and Speaker out from one PS-100 to the other.
Something’s off with the original unit, at this low volume it’s not quite as clear but at louder volumes (which I can’t really do right now as it’s evening and I live in a neighborhood) it seems to be more obvious, maybe sounding a but more ragged.
Hey Dan - Should I open up a support case? When the issue initially happened with the tubes, Vintage King mentioned swapping it out for another unit but I wanted to do it the easy way & not be a bother so I just went with some new tubes sent. It seems pretty clear now that the faulty tubes took out something else on their way out so now I’m kinda wishing I’d just gone ahead and swapped it for another unit.
Thanks again for all your help on this. Standing by for guidance.
When I listened to the latest clip, I have to say I cannot tell a difference. was this using the front panel controls to match the sound as best as you could?
I cannot think of a way the tubes failing would take out anything else. That said, of course we don’t want you to be disappointed with the product! What are the return terms with the dealer? I see you purchased from Vintage King. Do you also have purchase dates for those two units?
Dave, might have other suggestions. For example, he might want to investigate a bit more or have seen something like this before. So let’s wait for him to chime in.
It could be caused by the difference in power tube brand between the two. But in that, I’d expect the hotter one to be the louder one. At any rate, you’re welcome to ship it here and we’ll give it a once over. There are both from the same production batch, so that simplifies things.
In the most recent clip, the depth switch is on deep and the depth knob is maxed on the faulty ps-100. On the good ps-100 they’re set to flat and at noon. The volume on the faulty unit was around noon whereas on the good unit it was around 10:00.
Support at Vintage King is standing by to see what happens with our talks here. I purchased the unit in question on Feb 5th so I’m well outside their return window. The second unit was purchased just a couple weeks ago and it working great.
I’m thinking at this point about having the tech I usually go to here take a look at it. He’s extremely capable & by the time I pay shipping back to Ca, I might as well just pay his bench fee & not have to deal with shipping.
